Discussion:
Chappaquiddick
(too old to reply)
Ubiquitous
2018-03-28 16:31:49 UTC
Permalink
I had to make a double-take when I heard a promo for the upcoming
Ted Kennedy TV movie which warned of adult situation, language, and
"historical smoking".

Wait, what?
--
Dems & the media want Trump to be more like Obama, but then he'd
have to audit liberals & wire tap reporters' phones.
suzeeq
2018-03-28 18:42:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ubiquitous
I had to make a double-take when I heard a promo for the upcoming
Ted Kennedy TV movie which warned of adult situation, language, and
"historical smoking".
Wait, what?
Heh. I suppose some people would be offended by all the smoking that was
done in the 60s.
Obveeus
2018-03-28 23:48:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
I had to make a double-take when I heard a promo for the upcoming Ted
Kennedy TV movie which warned of adult situation, language, and
"historical smoking".
Wait, what?
Heh. I suppose some people would be offended by all the smoking that was
done in the 60s.
All smoking is offensive...and always has been offensive.
anim8rfsk
2018-03-28 19:05:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ubiquitous
I had to make a double-take when I heard a promo for the upcoming
Ted Kennedy TV movie which warned of adult situation, language, and
"historical smoking".
Wait, what?
At least with everybody involved now dead they'll be able to be as nasty
as they want to with the script.
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
Rhino
2018-03-28 19:49:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ubiquitous
I had to make a double-take when I heard a promo for the upcoming
Ted Kennedy TV movie which warned of adult situation, language, and
"historical smoking".
Wait, what?
Well, you see, back in the Dark Ages (the first several decades of the
20th century and several centuries before then), it was actually
"normal" for many people in all walks of life to smoke cigarettes, pipes
or even cigars on occasion. But gradually it became clearer and clearer
that smoking wasn't actually as good for you as some of the advertising
had been claiming so it was made harder and harder to smoke anywhere.
This accounts for why some younger people may not be quite sure what
smoking actually *is* or confuse it with consumption of marijuana or
other "nefarious combustibles".

Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL but lest people jump to
the conclusion that all *smokers* were also evil, we have to suppress
the act of smoking from all video depictions made after we became
enlightened about the pernicious effects of tobacco. However, sometimes
historical accuracy *demands* that smoking be depicted as it actually
occurred in those days. In those rare cases, it becomes essential to
provide trigger warnings so that no one thinks smoking is actually being
encouraged: the smoking is only there to make the program look realistic.

Therefore, if the movie shows Teddy Kennedy or Mary Jo Kopechne smoking,
people should NOT deduce that they are evil simply because they smoked.

However, everyone should feel free to consider Teddy evil if he actually
evaded responsibility for the incident that killed Kopechne as so many
people believe.
--
Rhino
BTR1701
2018-03-28 20:14:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
suzeeq
2018-03-28 20:26:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
BTR1701
2018-03-28 20:51:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
It sure ain't good for you, though.
trotsky
2018-03-28 21:58:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
It sure ain't good for you, though.
Holy fuck are you mind numbingly stupid. A) you just admitted you lied
when you conflated the two. B) Reducing carcinogens IS good for your
health:




---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
trotsky
2018-03-28 22:00:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
It sure ain't good for you, though.
Holy fuck are you mind numbingly stupid. A) you just admitted you lied
when you conflated the two. B) Reducing carcinogens IS good for your
health:

https://www.alternet.org/drugs/what-are-risks-marijuana-smoke-compared-tobacco
Post by BTR1701
Robert Melamede explainedthat although tobacco smoke and marijuana smoke have some similar chemical properties, the two substances possess different pharmacological activities and are not equally carcinogenic. Specifically, he affirmed that marijuana smoke contains multiple cannabinoids – many of which possess anti-cancer activity – and therefore likely exerts “a protective effect against pro-carcinogens that require activation.”
Now go ahead and crawl on your belly back into the woodwork.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
anim8rfsk
2018-03-28 23:24:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
But is still dangerous to your health, and smoking both tobacco and
marijuana is way worse than just using one or the other.
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
Obveeus
2018-03-29 00:15:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
But is still dangerous to your health, and smoking both tobacco and
marijuana is way worse than just using one or the other.
They could always limit the legalization to pill form or even edibles
form and avoid the issue of toxic waste drifting upon others.
shawn
2018-03-29 11:57:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
But is still dangerous to your health, and smoking both tobacco and
marijuana is way worse than just using one or the other.
They could always limit the legalization to pill form or even edibles
form and avoid the issue of toxic waste drifting upon others.
That would be great. I've had issues with having my windows open and
downstairs neighbors deciding to smoke both marijuana and cigarettes.
Neither one provides me with a pleasant scent.

Though one thing about edibles is you won't be easily able to see when
someone is consuming marijuana as I used to see every morning. This
guy would get in his car and light up his joint before driving off to
work.
Obveeus
2018-03-29 12:03:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by shawn
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
But is still dangerous to your health, and smoking both tobacco and
marijuana is way worse than just using one or the other.
They could always limit the legalization to pill form or even edibles
form and avoid the issue of toxic waste drifting upon others.
That would be great. I've had issues with having my windows open and
downstairs neighbors deciding to smoke both marijuana and cigarettes.
Neither one provides me with a pleasant scent.
Though one thing about edibles is you won't be easily able to see when
someone is consuming marijuana as I used to see every morning. This
guy would get in his car and light up his joint before driving off to
work.
I've only been in Atlanta's rush hour traffic a few times, but I can see
why drivers would want to mellow out before trying it.
shawn
2018-03-29 17:24:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Obveeus
Post by shawn
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
But is still dangerous to your health, and smoking both tobacco and
marijuana is way worse than just using one or the other.
They could always limit the legalization to pill form or even edibles
form and avoid the issue of toxic waste drifting upon others.
That would be great. I've had issues with having my windows open and
downstairs neighbors deciding to smoke both marijuana and cigarettes.
Neither one provides me with a pleasant scent.
Though one thing about edibles is you won't be easily able to see when
someone is consuming marijuana as I used to see every morning. This
guy would get in his car and light up his joint before driving off to
work.
I've only been in Atlanta's rush hour traffic a few times, but I can see
why drivers would want to mellow out before trying it.
Atlanta's traffic is still nothing compared to Boston's. That's the
worst that I've experienced in America.
Obveeus
2018-03-29 18:58:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by shawn
Post by Obveeus
Post by shawn
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
But is still dangerous to your health, and smoking both tobacco and
marijuana is way worse than just using one or the other.
They could always limit the legalization to pill form or even edibles
form and avoid the issue of toxic waste drifting upon others.
That would be great. I've had issues with having my windows open and
downstairs neighbors deciding to smoke both marijuana and cigarettes.
Neither one provides me with a pleasant scent.
Though one thing about edibles is you won't be easily able to see when
someone is consuming marijuana as I used to see every morning. This
guy would get in his car and light up his joint before driving off to
work.
I've only been in Atlanta's rush hour traffic a few times, but I can see
why drivers would want to mellow out before trying it.
Atlanta's traffic is still nothing compared to Boston's. That's the
worst that I've experienced in America.
The congestion there is caused by too many Dunkin Donuts. Last time I
drove through there Boston I went right by without even noticing because
I was underground.
Adam H. Kerman
2018-03-30 02:43:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
But is still dangerous to your health, and smoking both tobacco and
marijuana is way worse than just using one or the other.
So add in drinking, too!
FPP
2018-03-28 23:51:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
And you sure as shit don't have to SMOKE it. The same can not be said
of cigarettes.
--
"Tinkle, tinkle little Czar, Putin put you where you are." -George Takei
NoBody
2018-03-29 11:09:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
Wrongo!

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/318854.php
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4827335/#!po=56.7308
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/smoking-heart-health-pot-or-tobacco/
Adam H. Kerman
2018-03-30 02:42:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
You're thinking of the weed you smoked as a kid. Today's weed has highly
concentrated drug in it. Agribusiness has turned something innocuous
into something highly dangerous.
suzeeq
2018-03-30 13:28:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
You're thinking of the weed you smoked as a kid. Today's weed has highly
concentrated drug in it. Agribusiness has turned something innocuous
into something highly dangerous.
I meant it's not as dangerous because it doesn't have tars or nicotine.
Which is still more addictive than heroin - marijuana isn't addictive at
all.
Obveeus
2018-03-30 15:03:39 UTC
Permalink
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
suzeeq
2018-03-30 15:54:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
No I haven't, not for a long time. It's not physiological addicting.
Obveeus
2018-03-30 16:02:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
No I haven't, not for a long time. It's not physiological addicting.
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-addictive
anim8rfsk
2018-03-30 16:29:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
No I haven't, not for a long time. It's not physiological addicting.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
Obveeus
2018-03-30 19:00:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
No I haven't, not for a long time. It's not physiological addicting.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
Is this a way of self-gifting ice cream?
anim8rfsk
2018-03-30 19:18:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by suzeeq
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
No I haven't, not for a long time. It's not physiological addicting.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
Is this a way of self-gifting ice cream?
Mmmmm.
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
anim8rfsk
2018-03-30 16:25:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
BTR1701
2018-03-30 16:58:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
I see what you did there.
Obveeus
2018-03-30 18:59:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
Don't make me bite you.
anim8rfsk
2018-03-30 19:18:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
Don't make me bite you.
Do I *look* like Snausages?
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
Obveeus
2018-03-30 19:28:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
Don't make me bite you.
Do I *look* like Snausages?
Sort of.
anim8rfsk
2018-03-30 21:11:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by Obveeus
Post by anim8rfsk
Post by Obveeus
marijuana isn't addictive at all.
I think you've been smoking too much of something.
There must be a rare planetary alignment or something happening today
because I actually agree with Obveeus here. It's like feeding your dog
at the dinner table. All it does is reinforce the undesirable behavior.
Don't make me bite you.
Do I *look* like Snausages?
Sort of.
It's a fair cop.
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
anim8rfsk
2018-03-30 16:04:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by suzeeq
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Which isn't as dangerous to your health as cigarettes.
You're thinking of the weed you smoked as a kid. Today's weed has highly
concentrated drug in it. Agribusiness has turned something innocuous
into something highly dangerous.
I meant it's not as dangerous because it doesn't have tars or nicotine.
Which is still more addictive than heroin - marijuana isn't addictive at
all.
Bah. Sure it is. You never had a friend who wouldn't/couldn't go out
to eat before he smoked a joint? They're as twitchy as any other
addict. Lots of search hits for it, like "Marijuana is often thought to
be non-addictive. But cannabis dependence disorder is real, and affects
around 1 in 10 users."
--
Join your old RAT friends at
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1688985234647266/
A Friend
2018-03-28 20:33:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
The "same crowd" wants to do both? Really? Who *are* these people?

I do know that there are people who think it's stupid and pointless to
send people to jail for using marijuana, but that's not the same as
saying that everybody should use it. I also know that people don't go
to jail for using tobacco, so that's not an issue.
Rhino
2018-03-28 20:47:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
There's no moral consistency to these people; it's all about demolishing
the way things are being done in favour of having everything be different.
--
Rhino
FPP
2018-03-28 23:53:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rhino
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
There's no moral consistency to these people; it's all about demolishing
the way things are being done in favour of having everything be different.
Oh? Are there cigarette edibles now?
Or tobacco oils?

No? Then it's another false equivalency. But, then, you'd know that if
you took 3 seconds to look at the facts, instead of running your mouth.

It ain't all about Left vs Right politics.
--
"Tinkle, tinkle little Czar, Putin put you where you are." -George Takei
moviePig
2018-03-28 21:44:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Sort of like pro-lifers being pro-gun?
--
- - - - - - - -
YOUR taste at work...
http://www.moviepig.com
trotsky
2018-03-28 21:54:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
How is that hilarious, Jar Jar? Nicotine is more addicting than heroin.
THC is about as addicting as Diet Coke. Yet your motherfucking pea
brain conflates the two. In true right wing fashion you're ostensibly
saying "I'm ignorant as fuck, what do you guys think?"

This is from '87. This shit isn't news:

https://www.nytimes.com/1987/03/29/magazine/nicotine-harder-to-kickthan-heroin.html

https://www.alternet.org/drugs/what-are-risks-marijuana-smoke-compared-tobacco
Post by BTR1701
Marijuana Smoke vs. Tobacco Smoke
Writing in the Harm Reduction Journal in 2005, noted cannabis researcher Robert Melamede explainedthat although tobacco smoke and marijuana smoke have some similar chemical properties, the two substances possess different pharmacological activities and are not equally carcinogenic. Specifically, he affirmed that marijuana smoke contains multiple cannabinoids – many of which possess anti-cancer activity – and therefore likely exerts “a protective effect against pro-carcinogens that require activation.” Melamede concluded, “Components of cannabis smoke minimize some carcinogenic pathways whereas tobacco smoke enhances some.”
Tell me you stupid libertarian piece of rat shit, how do you reach the
point where you longer care about the facts in any situation? Don't you
feel a lot like Trump?



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
FPP
2018-03-28 23:49:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
Care to give us the stats on how many people have died from smoking pot,
as opposed to smoking cigarettes?
--
"Tinkle, tinkle little Czar, Putin put you where you are." -George Takei
NoBody
2018-03-29 11:04:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Rhino
Now, of course, we now know that tobacco is EVIL
What's hilarious is that the same crowd that wants to ban cigarettes
everywhere they can is also the same crowd that's leading the charge to
legalize marijuana.
You noticed too :)
Adam H. Kerman
2018-03-30 02:38:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ubiquitous
I had to make a double-take when I heard a promo for the upcoming
Ted Kennedy TV movie which warned of adult situation, language, and
"historical smoking".
Wait, what?
pr0n?
Loading...